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Attendees:

Canonical Meeting Template (as a reminder):

1. Review of meeting agenda
2. Addressing issues

  • Description/Status of issue
  • Review of action items from previous meetings if any
  • Recommended actions and discussion of same
  • Close issue or identify next action items

3. Status updates from SMT members

  • Status update on significant activities
  • Review of prior open issues if any (and not addressed earlier in agenda)
  • Identification of new issues if any (and not addressed earlier in agenda)

Agenda/Notes

1. Review of Meeting Agenda: Any comments/additions? 


2. XSEDE2 Reporting (Leslie Froeschl

Previously:

  • Previous discussion archived: SMT Meeting - February 25, 2021
  • (3/25) L3s should be finalizing submission of PY11 planning text to PMs. L2 deadline for final text is next Wednesday 3/31. 
    • Annual report process will start May 1.
  • (4/8) Wrapping up PY11 plan today. 
    • XAB: Friday April 16 10am-1pm CT; Slides due by end of day TODAY (with questions for XAB feedback).  Please place them here: https://drive.google.com/drive/u/3/folders/1Cm7K7KajAIjJKaoTZcGIfMKloVS3720e.
    • Requested SP Forum volunteers to sign up to review/provide feedback to an L2 of their choosing. Sent reminder today and hope to get at least one reviewer for each L2 area. L2s: please send Leslie a few times you could do a 30-min call with these folks in the next couple weeks. 
    • Annual report process will start May 1. 
  • (4/22) Meetings with SP Forum reps set up for CEE, XCI, Ops. Still working on scheduling ECSS & PgO. No one signed up for RAS. 
    • Annual report process begins May 1. 

Discussion: 

Decisions:


3. XSEDE2 Spin-Down Date (John Towns

Previously: 

  • (3/25) Added to agenda
    • If we go a long time without knowing who the successor is, there will come a point that we'll have to start ramping down. Trying to understand if there is a date that we will start shutting things down & won't be able to start back up without reasonable amount of effort or that there wouldn't be enough funded time to bring back. At which point transition becomes unavailable.
    • Survey of all services–some don't have mapping to the new plan. 3 month timeframe has been discussed to notify users that there isn't a direct mapping. 
    • What to do about XDCDB as it holds everything together. Down time for XDCDB will be significant. 
    • Issue shut down command to all servers on 8/31/22 with hope that they can be brought back up. 
    • Need to communicate across the project for PY11 planning and to successor awards so they know what the drop dead date is. 
    • Could be awkward in allocations. Allocations could be made and then nothing to give them. Mitigation plan for this.
    • When to stop offering ECSS: ECSS has discussed this and is working on language re. how they'll explain this. Possibly March 2022. 
    • Potential staff volatility towards end of award. 
    • Should be discussed in the PY11 plan. This is a good topic to get input from XAB on. 
  • (4/8)  Each L2 try to figure out latest date you would need to spin things down, process for spinning down, date of no return (latest date you wouldn't be able to start back up).
    • Do this exercise with your L2 managers. 
    • Plenty of work to do between now and end of project so shouldn't be characterized as negative. 
    • How challenging is this for the L2s? How much time is needed? 
      • ECSS: have been discussing this. Will be reflected in questions posing to XAB. Shouldn't be challenging to draft a timeline that indicates that final XRAC that ECSS will take allocations. Should be able to have this by next SMT meeting. 
      • XCI: Will need to align with RAS re. allocations, esp re. onboarding new SPs. 
      • Ops: need to think about each of the services, how complicated to spin back up. Should be able to provide update at next SMT
      • RAS: Question posed to Bob Chadduck re. XRAC at end of project to confirm that they want to proceed with that meeting since any allocations made would need to be transitioned to new award. A lot of risk involved in that meeting since we don't know who will take it over. Not sure how smooth the handover would be given lack of staff funding for RAS after 8/31. Waiting on answer to this. RAS is committed to helping to make it work one way or other, but that could be non-trivial. 
    • All L2s should have something sent to the leadership@xsede.org email list by Wednesday, April 21. 

Discussion: 

  • Resources to be spun down can be found at https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1BhNDGNCRh5tZZ4rhcqIZthm2Nay06N8dckWL1aVsOaI/edit#gid=0
    • Will need to do a dump of the wiki. 
    • Database is one of most important items. If no one to hand off to, could make a copy outside of AWS. 
    • NCSA would likely hold a copy of these things if needed. 
    • XCI: many services running in VMs, so will depend on policies at institutions where the VMs are housed. If there is a place to house things like that would be good. 
    • Dependencies of services. Need to consider that an account for it. If you haven't thought of this, you should check with who you're dependent on and confirm that your dates are still good. 
    • Could an SP receive a supplement to house data such as this? 
      • ACTION: All L2s send Leslie confirmation that the dates in the spreadsheet are good. 
  • Aug 2022 allocation activities: feedback from Bob C
    • Last XRAC occurs days  before end of XSEDE2. Concern about what will happen. Even if  we know who wins the award, they won't have their machinery up and running. Could forego allocations round (but need to let community know now if that is happening). OR could move the XRAC up a week to have time to get allocations set before XSEDE2 ends. Want to be the least disruptive as possible. Bob didn't have much feedback. Inclined to move the meeting up a week. 
      • Cancelling the meeting would be disruptive for the community and especially the SPs as it would result in under-utilization of machines followed by very heavy usage. 
      • Bob is fine with whatever we decide to do. 

Decisions: 

  • Next step for spin-down data? 
    • John to look through it more carefully. 
    • Will be part of a discussion with Bob C.
    • Should be factored into planning for the coming year. 
  • Final XRAC meeting: Will move the meeting up a week. John will talk with Dave & team. 

4. Fluid Numerics (Ron Payne  ) 

Previously:

  • (4/8) Added to agenda. Initial discussion indicated concerns about them being a commercial entity. See notes from that discussion at SMT Meeting - February 11, 2021
    • Letter from Fluid Numerics was sent by email on Feb. 5 (Leslie reforwarded to email list today). 
    • Concern about them using as a marketing tool for their services. Need to understand their expectations re. what they would contribute & receive. 
    • Might be interesting to entertain what it would look like to allocate commercial cloud services. Could be partner in exploring that space (understanding there are many risks). 
    • Not clear if what they're offering is at cost or not. They need to understand that our SPs offer their services at no cost.
    • Does this involve any pilot work for XSEDE? We're in process of ramping down, so do we want to spin up a pilot? They didn't propose a pilot.
    • What is an analog to Fluid Numerics? HDF? not formally associated with a university. Feels like a similar type of org. 
    • Affiliate member of COVID consortium, and they've offered their service for free to that. Not sure if they will offer to XSEDE for free as well. 
    • As an L3 they wouldn't need to provide anything. Just need to fill out what they have available. Rules don't say that it has to be only things that are free. Lets the community know it's available. 
    • Should we have special rules for commercial entities? Is there a reason we shouldn't allow a commercial entity to participate? 
      • Don't want them to leverage their SPF position to grow their business/scrape contact info
      • Haven't put constraints on this in our SPF policies re. limitations
      • NSF allowing grants to write these kinds of services into their budgets & expect national allocations process to be able to allocate these kinds of things. Don't see why XSEDE can't start moving towards this. 
      • As long as they understand this is a technical interaction–not a marketing tool for them. As long as they agree to this, we should explore it.
    • Need clarification from Fluid Numerics re. uncertainties. Ron Payneto send request for clarification. 
    • What would they offer to community for no cost? Under what terms/costs would they offer things to the community? 
      • They should describe themselves as a fee-for-service entity if there is some cost associated so people understand. No need to outline price structure.   
    • Be clear we expect them not to use this as a marketing tool. No explicit marketing opportunities here. This is a technical engagement–not marketing opportunity.
    • What value they bring to the community and what they expect to get out of the participation?
    • Decision will be made pending receipt of this clarification. 

Discussion: 

  • Request for info sent to Fluid Numerics 21-Apr 2021

Decisions:


5. Terminology Task Force (Linda Akli

Previously:

See archive of previous discussion at SMT Meeting - March 25, 2021

Discussion: 

  • Down to finishing touches. Reviewing staff training slides next week and will deliver first round of training to area leads on May 10. Will do a session at the June QM for staff. 

Decisions:


Around the call up

Follow this basic outline:

  • Status update on significant activities
  • Review of prior open issues if any (and not addressed earlier in agenda)
  • Identification of new issues if any (and not addressed earlier in agenda)
  • Identification of recent improvements implemented

Updates from SMT members:

  • PI (John/Ron) - 
    • Met with Bob today as mentioned above. 

  • Tim
    • No update

  • CEE (Kelly) - 
    • No update

  • ECSS (Bob S/Phil/Sergiu) -
    •  Planning ECSS all-hands meeting to discuss spin-down etc. in early June

  • XCI (Dave L/Tabitha/Shava) -  

    • Wrapping up activities: Replaced of Grid FTP as optional install for existing SPs; recommended for new SPs. Trying to wrap up phase 1 of COManage (includes Jira, Confluence, AWS)
    • Discussion transition plans. Seems that a lot of things XCI runs should run right up to the end & then help to move it to new awardee. 
      • Run as late as you can recognizing that you'll need time to spin down. Hope they'll have awardees in place, but without knowing that is the best we can do. 
      • A lot of documentation in CRI. IDEALS is persistent repository so anything there won't go away & they can point to it.

  • Ops (Greg/Victor) -   
    •   Talking about transition plan. Will run up to last day. Particularly XDCDB that is the underpin of most everything across the project. 
       
  • RAS (Dave H/Ken/Nathan) -  

    •  The allocations policies were approved by NSF, have been published to IDEALS, and are in the process of being updated in the portal documentation.
       
  • Program Office (Ron/Leslie) - 
    • Reminder: Enter Publications in XUP and documents in IDEALS
    • Reminder: Reference collaborations in tracking worksheet: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/19YRAPeAForh5I9Xvhj8nKjROe3-JN7a1caLYbNamPaw
    • Reminder: Address recommendations (Jira)    
    • Verbal support received from Bob C. re. UMich being a subaward so we can continue work with IRIS. 
    • Collecting updated spend plans from all subs. Should have a report out to leadership in first week of May so we can make PY11 spending decisions. 
  • SP Forum (Ruth) -  

    • Nice presentation from a CC* project
    • Appreciated the format of the XAB meeting last week. The format was very engaging. 

  • UAC (Emre) -   
    • No update
       
  • NSF (Bob C) - 


Next Meeting:     SMT - May 6, 2021 


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